Today:
Members of a Topeka, Kans., church have announced plans to protest at actor Heath Ledger's memorial service, because he played a gay character in the film "Brokeback Mountain."
This is according to various news reports as well as Westboro Baptist Church's own Web site. This church also has picketed funerals of gay people and soldiers killed overseas.
Many have protested the protesters' past activities. The church certainly seems hungry for publicity. How do you feel about their plans to protest at Ledger's service? Do they have a right to be there?
"I wholly agree with what you have to say but will defend to the death your right to say it." This quote might be appropriate but these guys are clearly wacko...
We were in Topeka this past weekend for a funeral, and we think it may be possible that a city could be so boring as to melt your brain enough to think s--- like this up... basically, we're saying it is no wonder this church is from Topeka.
I don't think that anyone should protest a funeral service, there is a time and place for protest and a funeral is not one of them. These people are so cowardly that they have to protest at places where the person they are in protest of is not able to stand up for themselves. Instead they inflict pain on already grieving friends and family. For shame.
I'm no supporter of homosexuality, don't really have that big a problem with them but I don't support it, but this is just ridiculous. First off why would you protest anyone's funeral. Second he was an actor. It just doesn't sound very Christian of them. People like this make a whole lot of other people look bad.
What I mean to say is even if you have a problem with someone (which I have no idea why they would with an actor just doing his job) you should still show some respect for the guy. I'm sure he was a good guy and he doesn't deserve that.
I'd go so far as to say that protesting at funerals isn't just inappropriate, it's lazy.
If that church wants to do some good in the world; why not build houses for the needy, or raise funds to feed and cloth people. I could name a hundred proactive things they could spend their time on that would have a 100% positive impact.
If you have a problem with something - fine, that's your opinion - but protesting at a funeral is never appropriate. Never.
My feeling is they have the legal right to do it, but that doesn't mean it isn't disgusting, because it is. Protesting won't unmake the movie, nor will it do much for converting people who don't hate gay people as much as they do to their cause. All you can really conclude is they're exploiting the situation for publicity and for the benefit of showing off in front of their "congregation."
I believe everyone should have the right to their opinion, even if it is different from everyone else. I also believe everyone has a right to express their thoughts, beliefs, and ideas in whatever form they choose to, as long as it doesn't hurt or infringe on anothers' rights and freedoms. Even if it is often in poor taste.
That being said...
It's sad to think many of these institutions, that are supposed to promote inclusion and unity, often times spread hatred and ignorance and fear. First of all it puts a negative spin on religion. And second, I would agree they have better things they could be doing than harrassing people at funerals or memorials. What's to stop them from following innocent people to their places of business, or stalking them at their personal homes?
It is also a sad fact that many people JUST DON'T GET IT. And even that many more don't want to. They like living in fear and with primative thoughts. The Bible was never meant to be taken literally. It is filled with symbols, poems, dreams, and is meant to be interpreted by the Holy Spirit, not by our own (literal) understanding.
As far as Brokeback Mountain goes: I liked the movie. Most people watching made a big deal about the homosexual aspect, but the move was about more than that. I don't think the story would have worked with a guy and a woman working together. Would they have been able to sneak off on fishing trips together, without their significant other becoming aware of something going on?
Lastly: Homosexuality is about as wrong as using a butter knife to tighten a screw on the kitchen cabnet, when you couldn't locate a screwdriver close by. It wasn't designed for that, however it worked just as well. And if we're protesting that, let's protest other things that aren't natural: hair plugs, tattoos, piercings, cosmetic surgery, breast implants, and several hundred more things we weren't born with. These are common aspects of our culture which have become normal. And from a religious/spiritual point of view (since this was instigated by a congregation), to say that something like homosexuality is wrong or not in the divine plan, is to say that there is no divine order. That there is something God can want, but not get. God wants people to be saved, and yet according to many Christians, this won't happen. How can God want something and not get it?
Absolutely, the church members have a legal right to express their views. But I agree with Nicole that there's a time and place for protest, and that Heath Ledger's memorial service is not one of them. When did a funeral or memorial service stop being a time for people to pay their last respects to the deceased? It also seems that anyone who would condemn Ledger for playing a homosexual in "Brokeback Mountain" is missing larger themes in the movie -- such as the horrific nature of hate crimes, and the harm done to those forced to hide who they are.
There's a fine line between exercising your right to free speech and being a jerk. And you can't have rights without accepting the consequences of exercising them. I'd be well within my constitutional rights to tell everyone I see that they suck, but I'd better be prepared for a first-class ass-kicking. And you can't get up in someone's face and tell them that God hates them when they're at their most vulnerable and expect them to sit there and take it.
Personally I think free speech is overrated. What happened to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness?
expressing views and leaving a family to mourn their son and father are two different things...people need to quit hiding behind the bible...its not our duty to judge...thats for the higher power.
Never is it ok for a group to protest a funeral! A funeral is a place to leave any grudge you had against that person behind and simply mourn their death. Especially if their protest is based on hatred and trying to spread that hatred. This group is absolutely horrible, they target homosexuals and use god as their excuse. To me there is no worse form of exploitation or hypocracy.
I sincerely hope that this group never finds out where/when the funeral is taking place. Can you imagine being his parents and seeing that? I mean he has a little girl, should she be exposed to that?
I'm a pretty big supporter of the church's role to be visible and actively making a difference in the community they are planted in, but trying to make a condemning point at anyone's funeral seems cowardly at best. I'm not saying it would be right to protest or hassle him while he were alive, but at least there he could choose to give his side of the story if he felt like it deserved his time and attention. Not to mention that it's disrespectful to the family left behind trying to say their goodbyes. That being said, while I don't know of the church in KS and what their motivations are, I am inclined to believe (As misguided as the timing and method is) that they think they are doing what God would want them to do more than trying to get attention for themselves. I think they are trying to bring attention to something that they believe is important to God, but it's the wrong place, time & way to go about it.
Never is it ok for a group to protest a funeral! A funeral is a ...
If any group abides by local laws concerning where public demonstrations can take place, then of course they have a right to protest whatever they want.
"Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."
You know somtimes you have to wonder about the intelligence of some people. Obviously they just want to free publicity to attract more weirdos to their cause. Most people do know he was just playing a part in a movie and that it's not real- or maybe they think everything they see on tv and film is real. Come to think about it..... Maybe I should sue gatorage- we drink that stuff all the time and we never sweat in color like the commercials show.. I guess it's not in me. I don't believe they should be allowed to protest at anyone's funeral. It is the final farwell the family has- and no little girl should have to have that memory forever.
If any group abides by local laws concerning where public demonstrations can take place, then ...
Well, I know that it is their constitutional right... but does that make it ok?
Well, I know that it is their constitutional right... but does that make it ok?
Doesn't matter if it's OK or not. It's a right.
Now having said that, I wonder why some groups haven't exercised their right to gather outside the Topeka church and protest. Oops, I forgot. No one's there. They're too busy traveling to other places to protest.
Doesn't matter if it's OK or not. It's a right. Now having said that, I ...
That would be something to do. Or maybe protest out in front of the pastor/reverend/minister's house.
They have a right to protest anywhere, but that doesn't mean it's morally OK to do so. Certain zones of privacy should be respected, and funerals certainly fall into that category.
For the same reasons, I think it's perfectly fine to protest at a politician's office or business, but not their home.
If any group abides by local laws concerning where public demonstrations can take place, then ...
By the same line of reasoning, would it be acceptable and legal for me to drive to Topeka and protest their hypocracy and generally just being dou&%$bags just outside their own church and Sunday services?
I this a right that the Constitution protects for me as well? If it is, I might need consider the idea of a Roadtrip! Anyone interested in tagging along? ;)
Here's a BBC documentary on the congregation: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4413388146858417528&q=westboro+baptist+church&total=629&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=1